no one has mention the integration of LibGuides into other packages. Anyone here involved with Summon 2.0? it is integrating libguides... but we are not a libguide site. curious if others would put that into the consideration bucket.
Sent from New Gadget
On Aug 11, 2013, at 9:13 PM, Lauren Magnuson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> I've worked at a small, under-resourced institution that had LibGuides,
> despite the fact that as a staff member I did have the technical know-how
> to install and maintain an open-source solution. So why didn't we? My
> existing job duties without an open-source guide project already demanded
> 120% of a full-time position. With no time to investigate and test an
> open-source solution, the value we got back for our LibGuides cost was my
> time as a staff member to do other things. We weren't going to be able to
> pay for additional staff support with $1000 / yr.
>
> Some small libraries at institutions also have very little say at the IT
> negotiation table - for examples, policies may exist that state that any
> campus department wishing to host software either ask to use the existing
> campus host or ask for (read: beg) permission to go with one's own host if
> there's a desire to use a code library that isn't supported by the campus
> host (and there are a lot of institutions with leadership that is VERY
> suspicious of open source, and therefore only use proprietary frameworks
> like ASP.NET). Either way, you're begging for permission to have access to
> something. I've been in this situation where the reaction to a request to
> pursue open-source is disbelief - how can those luddites in the library
> possibly have the skill/experience/interest in getting themselves into
> something like this? It can be very hard to justify when an administrator
> is also expecting the one person who would know how to manage the
> open-source project to leave at any time, and IT certainly doesn't want to
> provide staff time to support some weirdo project librarians came up with.
> There are university libraries that are moving toward using LibGuides as
> their entire library web presence. In many cases this is because just to
> change a link on their university-provided library website they have to go
> through 6 layers of approval and wait two weeks.
>
> It's not an ideal situation, and may not be helping the big picture, but
> there are lots of libraries that are just trying to survive. Thus,
> LibGuides. FWIW, we got a lot of usage out of it, and cost per use was
> incredibly low (and much lower than cpu for our other
> subscriptions/databases).
>
> Lauren Magnuson
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 5:20 PM, Andrew Darby <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> I don't get this argument at all. Why is it "counter productive to try to
>> look at open source alternatives" if the vendor's option is relatively
>> cheap? Why wouldn't you investigate all options? Maybe the vendor option
>> makes sense, maybe the open source option does.
>>
>> The "technology skills" for open source software are on the
>> install/maintenance side. It's not like the content creator has to do some
>> crazy programming if they want to create a guide in the open source option,
>> while in LibGuides a team of angels guides their every click and drag.
>>
>> And if technology skills are missing, how does writing a check to
>> Springshare remedy the situation? How does sending that check to
>> Springshare benefit the "small poorly resourced" libraries?
>>
>> I assume I'm preaching to choir when I say that we should all be open to
>> supporting our peers' open source efforts, rather than dismissing them out
>> of hand.
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 5:49 PM, Wilhelmina Randtke <[log in to unmask]
>>> wrote:
>>
>>> Technology tools are a non issue here. Straightforward documented open
>>> source technology is readily available. What is missing is technology
>>> skills. Someone can't buy those if they don't already have technology
>>> skills, or else they are a sitting duck for scammers.
>>>
>>> With a basic pricing of about $1000 a year, it's counter productive to
>> try
>>> look at open source alternatives. $1000 a year with more handholding is
>>> good. Even companies, like lishost, which do open source for libraries
>>> price in this same range, because they have to take on more handholding.
>> I
>>> also don't see vendor lock in issues in LibGuides, since the research
>>> guides concept includes routine change and replacing content.
>>>
>>> If you want libraries to operate better, what you should be doing is
>> having
>>> conversations with people from a variety of libraries, including small
>>> poorly resourced ones, recognizing that there is a spectrum of needs, and
>>> being available to provide realistic advice. (That advice would be
>>> different for different libraries.)
>>>
>>> Lack of access to technology skill creates the situations in which
>>> LibGuides is useful and beneficial. Lack of access to technology
>>> skill causes most situations in which LibGuides are a counter productive
>>> waste of time, whether that's a misguided administrator or poor
>>> interdepartmental communication (yes, even competent IT housed in a
>> library
>>> is sometimes not proactive and helpful at being in touch with IT-hostile
>>> reference departments). If you have technology skill, then by having
>> broad
>>> connections and being available to give advice or pointers, you can
>> assist
>>> libraries / departments that don't have the luxury of having access to
>>> technology skill. If all you do is drum on open source diy, when there
>> is
>>> a low cost alternative that works, then you harm things.
>>>
>>> -Wilhelmina Randtke
>>>
>>> On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 2:04 PM, Andrew Darby <[log in to unmask]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> There are open source solutions created by librarians: SubjectsPlus
>> and
>>>> Library a la Carte.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Cornel Darden Jr. <
>>>> [log in to unmask]
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello?
>>>>>
>>>>> Soringshre's link-rot tool has gotten much better. Even at alerting
>>>> admins
>>>>> about broken links. I think $999 a year for the basic package is
>> worth
>>> it
>>>>> since most librarians aren't coders like we 'ALL' should be! Maybe an
>>>> open
>>>>> source solution created by librarians is needed. However database
>>>>> management will still require librarians to pick up those skills like
>>> SQL
>>>>> that we too often think isn't or shouldn't be a skill that a
>> librarian
>>>> must
>>>>> have. It's the 21st century!!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Cornel Darden Jr.
>>>>> MSLIS
>>>>> Librarian
>>>>> Kennedy-King College
>>>>> City Colleges of Chicago
>>>>> Work 773-602-5449
>>>>> Cell 708-705-2945
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Aug 11, 2013, at 11:21 AM, Robert Sebek <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Heather Rayl <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have to say that I loathe LibGuides. My library makes extensive
>>> use
>>>> of
>>>>>>> them, too. Need a web solution? The first thing out of someone's
>>> mouth
>>>>> is
>>>>>>> "Let's put it in a LibGuide!"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shudder
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This fall, I'll be moving our main site over to Drupal, and I'm
>>> hoping
>>>>> that
>>>>>>> eventually I can convince people to re-invent their LibGuides
>>> there. I
>>>>> can
>>>>>>> use the "saving money" card, and the "content silos are bad" card
>>> and
>>>>>>> *maybe* I will be successful.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anyone fought this particular battle before?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ~heather
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm fighting that battle right now. We have an excellent CMS into
>>>> which
>>>>> I
>>>>>> have set up all our database URLs, descriptions, etc.Anytime we
>> need
>>> to
>>>>>> refer to a database on a page, we use one of those entries. That
>>>> database
>>>>>> just changed platforms? No problem. I change the URL in one place
>> and
>>>>>> everything automatically updates (hooray CMSs!).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All of our subject guides (http://www.lib.vt.edu/subject-guides/)
>>> are
>>>> in
>>>>>> the CMS using the exact same database entries. I converted from our
>>>>>> failing, home-grown system into the CMS and then gave training on
>> how
>>>> to
>>>>>> maintain from there (remove an entry, add an entry, create a
>> parallel
>>>>>> course guide)--using the same skills as maintaining any other web
>>> page
>>>>> that
>>>>>> librarian is responsible for. But apparently that's too hard.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So we have a trial of LibGuides. NO ONE here has created a guide
>> from
>>>>>> scratch yet, but they all say this is going to be easy. No one
>> will
>>>>> admit
>>>>>> that someone will have to recreate all those database entries
>>>> (literally
>>>>>> hundreds) and then maintain those entries. When presented with
>> this,
>>>>>> several librarians said--oh that won't be necessary, we'll just
>>> create
>>>>>> individual entries as needed on individual guides. WHAT?!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If implemented, we'll have hundreds and hundreds of entries, any of
>>>> which
>>>>>> could be out of date and nonfunctional, with no easy way to find
>> and
>>>> fix,
>>>>>> other than waiting for patrons to complain that the link doesn't
>>> work.
>>>>> Ugh.
>>>>>> All for several thousand dollar a year (as opposed for free in the
>>>> CMS).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yes, those librarians' favorite example libguides have a dozen
>>> tabs
>>>>>> with hundreds of links on each tab. Overwhelm the patron with
>>>> links--who
>>>>>> cares! Just let me recreate the Yahoo Directory I so miss with
>> every
>>>>>> possible resource I can find online. Half those links don't work
>> next
>>>>>> semester? Doesn't matter, as no one will ever maintain that page
>>> again
>>>>> (and
>>>>>> no patron will use it, since they will just Google these resources
>>>>> anyway).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Robert Sebek
>>>>>> Webmaster, Virginia Tech Libraries
>>>>>> (http://www.lib.vt.edu/)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Andrew Darby
>>>> Head, Web & Emerging Technologies
>>>> University of Miami Libraries
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Andrew Darby
>> Head, Web & Emerging Technologies
>> University of Miami Libraries
>
>
>
> --
> PALNI Systems Coordinator
> 530-949-5108
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