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I'm not sure, it seems to me that it could never be harmful, and could sometimes be helpful, for the CO generator to send all the information it has.  Sure, a good link resolver _should_ be able to resolve any valid ISSN, it shouldn't need multiple ISSNs.  But we all know that 'should' doesn't always happen (even in the best link resolver, there are gaps and errors in the knowledge base--and there can be errors in the generated CO too, maybe one of the ISSNs the generator knew about was in fact in error), and what's wrong with redundancy?  I think redundancy in this situation is good, gives the software more chances to recover from errant or missing metadata (which is a fact of life) and still provide a succesful outcome. Seems to me, if sending multiple ISSNs (or ISBNs) would harm link resolver performance, then _that's_ something to blame on a link resolver that's not smart enough.  If the generator knows lots of things about the work cited (including multiple ISSNs for the serial that holds it), why not send all the information on for the link resolver to use however it may (or may not) choose?

Jonathan


>>> Eric Hellman <[log in to unmask]> 02/28/08 12:51 PM >>>
I agree; issn is not an identifier for an article. But in general, a
resolver should be smart enough to know what serial is meant even if a
variant issn is supplied.

I do not agree that it would be helpful for generators to send
multiple issn's. They currently can send issn and eissn; if the
resolvers knowledgebase is good, then sending it multiple issns will
never help and will often degrade its performance. I think its sucky
to craft OpenURL metadata that caters to substandard resolvers.

On Feb 19, 2008, at 11:09 AM, Jonathan Rochkind wrote:

> Be careful though, please don't send an rft_id ISSN identifier for an
> _article level_ metadata package. OCLC does this. It's wrong, as the
> ISSN does not serve as an identifeir for the _article_ cited, but
> rather
> for the journal it's in. Until I figured out what was going on, this
> caused some bugs in Umlaut.
>
> It _would_ be nice to send multiple ISSNs even for an article-level
> citation. Let's say the generator of the OpenURL happens to know that
> there are several variant ISSNs for the publication, that identify
> differnet manifestations, but any of which are valid for the given
> article citation. It would be helpful for the generator to send them
> all
> along, in case the link resolver knows about some but not all of them,
> to increase the chances that the link resolver will properly
> 'recognize'
> the citation.
>
> But, it unfortunately can't be done. It's not the end of the world to
> realize that OpenURL isn't perfect (what is? By trying you learn from
> your experience to do better next time), but I'm unconvinced that this
> is actually desirable in any way instead of an oversight. One thing I
> think I feel like we've learned from many of our community's recent
> metadata initiatives is the importance of creating standards in such a
> way that they can be further developed and/or extended in a backwards
> compatible way. Ie, an OpenURL 1.1 or something, that was backwards
> comptable so it could be sent to resolvers that knew no more than 1.0
> without problems. This has to do with both the design of the
> structure/syntax of the metadata, as well as the design of the
> _processes_ of maintenance, to make this kind of extension and
> development not too cumbersome socially.
>
> Jonathan
>
> Karen Coyle wrote:
>> Ah, you're referring to rft_id, and I was looking at the ISBN
>> element in
>> the KEV Book format. So using rft_id would work.
>>
>> The reason for multiple ISBNs is that many MARC records have ISBNs
>> for
>> the hard copy and the paperback. Without going through some gyrations
>> you don't know which is which, although for purposes like ILL
>> either is
>> valid. There are also multi-volume works that each get an ISBN.
>>
>> Like other FRBR "levels" manifestation has a fairly wide range of
>> ambiguity. A book simultaneously published in two countries... is
>> that
>> one manifestation or two? What if they each get a separate ISBN? A
>> hardback and trade paperback that come out at the same time, where
>> the
>> only difference is the cover... and the ISBN?
>>
>> Although I often use the shortcut of "ISBN = manifestation" the
>> fact of
>> it is that ISBNs are publisher inventory and sales numbers and are
>> used
>> in ways that are convenient for publishers. They also get mis-
>> assigned
>> frequently, as some tests being run on bib data at the Open Library
>> are
>> showing.
>>
>> kc
>>
>> Ross Singer wrote:
>>> Actually, this:
>>> http://alcme.oclc.org/openurl/servlet/OAIHandler/extension?verb=GetMetadata&metadataPrefix=mtx&identifier=info:ofi/fmt:kev:mtx:ctx
>>>
>>>
>>> indicates that multiple rft_ids *are* valid, and, in fact, would
>>> have
>>> to be, since you could very easily have a DOI and a PMID and, say, a
>>> SICI.
>>>
>>> I have no idea what any resolver would do with this bundle of ISBNs,
>>> of course.  It also seems somewhat contrary to the intention of the
>>> Book metadata format, since I think it's (in my murky view of FRBR-y
>>> terms) trying to define a manifestation rather than the expression
>>> level that Bill is trying to use it for.  I could be weaving in my
>>> own
>>> interpretations and biases there.
>>>
>>> An alternative would be use by-reference context objects and then
>>> make
>>> the context objects available as XML.  You could have multiple
>>> context
>>> object available in one XML document this way.  A combination of
>>> COinS/unAPI could make something like this possible.
>>>
>>> -Ross.
>>>
>>> On Feb 18, 2008 6:53 PM, Karen Coyle <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> Actually, the max occurrence of ALL of the KEV keys is 1 except for
>>>> "au"
>>>> (which is unlimited). I remember discussions in which we
>>>> acknowledged
>>>> that one key NE one value, eg you could input multiple values if
>>>> your
>>>> recipients were in agreements (a poor excuse, I know). Thus:
>>>> "isbn:3333;isbn:8888". My only memory for why max=1 for all of
>>>> these is
>>>> that it has to do with the fact that there is no structure or
>>>> dependency
>>>> in KEV, so an OpenURL with keys
>>>>     &rft.au=nnn&rft.title=ttt&rft.au=pppp&rft.title=rrrr
>>>> isn't interpretable in terms of what authors go with what titles.
>>>> Why
>>>> the exception for au but for no other fields? My memory fails me
>>>> here.
>>>> Undoubtedly it made sense at the time.
>>>>
>>>> kc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jay Luker wrote:
>>>>> Hi William,
>>>>>
>>>>> According to the book KEV format (defined here:
>>>>> ttp://tinyurl.com/2psmkq) the max occurrence of the isbn key is
>>>>> 1. I'm
>>>>> assuming that by extension that means that the rft.<m-key> (i.e.,
>>>>> rft.isbn) form is also limited to one occurrence. So specifying
>>>>> multiple ISBNs that way is a no go.
>>>>>
>>>>> You can however specify multiple referent identifiers. From the
>>>>> KEV
>>>>> Context Object format matrix (http://tinyurl.com/2r5hsc):
>>>>> "Multiple
>>>>> instances of rft_id do not indicate multiple Referents, but rather
>>>>> multiple ways to identify a single Referent"
>>>>>
>>>>> So I *think* what you could do is this:
>>>>>
>>>>> "rft_id=urn:isbn:<isbn1>&rft_id=urn:isbn:<isbn2>&..."
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, I'd be remiss not to point you to a more authoritative
>>>>> list for
>>>>> OpenURL questions: http://listserv.oclc.org/scripts/wa.exe?A0=OPENURL
>>>>> .
>>>>> Although I'm sure there's plenty of overlap in interest/
>>>>> knowledge in
>>>>> the subject between the lists.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jay Luker [log in to unmask]
>>>>> Software Engineer, Ex Libris Inc.
>>>>> (617) 332-8800, x604 http://www.exlibrisgroup.com
>>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 17, 2008 3:14 AM, William Denton <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>> I'm hep to the COInS scene now and am using it in some lists of
>>>>>> books I'm
>>>>>> generating.  For some of the books I know multiple ISBNs.  Can I
>>>>>> include
>>>>>> them all in one COInS span somehow?  Doing one individually
>>>>>> makes my
>>>>>> OpenURL Referrer extension clutter up the page with a lot of
>>>>>> links.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I looked at the specification but it didn't seem to cover this.
>>>>>> generator.ocoins.info only seems to want one one ISBN.  Putting
>>>>>> multiple
>>>>>> rft.isbn variables just makes the last one overpower the earlier
>>>>>> ones.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any tips appreciated!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bill
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> William Denton, Toronto : www.miskatonic.org www.frbr.org
>>>>>> www.openfrbr.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> -----------------------------------
>>>> Karen Coyle / Digital Library Consultant
>>>> [log in to unmask] http://www.kcoyle.net
>>>> ph.: 510-540-7596   skype: kcoylenet
>>>> fx.: 510-848-3913
>>>> mo.: 510-435-8234
>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> -----------------------------------
>> Karen Coyle / Digital Library Consultant
>> [log in to unmask] http://www.kcoyle.net
>> ph.: 510-540-7596   skype: kcoylenet
>> fx.: 510-848-3913
>> mo.: 510-435-8234
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>
> --
> Jonathan Rochkind
> Digital Services Software Engineer
> The Sheridan Libraries
> Johns Hopkins University
> 410.516.8886
> rochkind (at) jhu.edu