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> I would disagree that sysadmin/network admin types are considered less > geeky, it's just that coders and sysadmins speak completely different > languages, tend not to trust each other, and are generally working against > one another (since they have different goals). Trying to figure this stuff out is like trying to determine whose cleric is better than whose wizard. Any coolness or status that we perceive is only among ourselves. Everyone else sees us socially as nerds and professionally as minions who to support others. Library technologists are infrastructure and like other infrastructure, they'll be ignored if they do their jobs well and reamed if they make a mistake. Who here thinks about the people who design sewers or concrete? You don't need to be able to write a line of code to help design a great program. Nor do you need to know any technology to be a hacker. Systems analysis, hacking, and coding are ways of thinking and do not refer to any specific skillset. If the community is to grow, this word needs to get out. kyle