I think that the programming / scripting / markup language discussion is
not helpful. Any time you key in something, run it on a computer, and
something else comes out (hopefully what is expected), to me, that
qualifies as programming.

Why not?


On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 6:47 AM, Wilhelmina Randtke <[log in to unmask]>wrote:

> "Probably it was the wrong course. I think coding should start with
> building web pages. A calculator can't do that."
> HTML is called "markup language", but does anyone here really think it's a
> programming language? Even though is gets more complicated over time, it
> pretty much doesn't have variables or do interactive things, and is for
> displaying things, not manipulating things.
> My point about math and programming is that the curriculum for the average
> intro programming class appears to have been developed circa 1972 and never
> tweaked.  I'm in Programming for Engineers right now, which is the
> prerequisite for the classes that looked useful.  So far we have written
> lots of small programs to add numbers, find modulos, make a simple loop.
> All this would have been exciting before calculators.  But, yeah, we have
> calculators now.  And, actually, we had calculators before we had
> widespread access to affordable computers.  Writing a page long program to
> add some numbers makes no sense.  It's probably the least efficient way to
> solve the problem.  Nothing about the coursework shows computers as useful
> at solving problems.  Everything about the coursework shows computers as
> clunky inefficient, difficult to use calculators.  And... here is something
> we haven't done...  We have not yet called a function from inside a
> function.  So, the whole object oriented thing has not yet appeared, and
> it's past midterm time.
> From having looked at a bunch of syllabi online for different intro level
> programming classes, I think my experiences are the norm.  The intro
> classes cover things you can do more easily without coding.
> This type of curriculum is off putting to at least some people.  It also
> isn't necessary.  I think it's possible to design a curriculum where
> students could have something to show that would be worthwhile now, as
> opposed to worthwhile in 1972 when adding many numbers at once was a big
> deal.
> -Wilhelmina Randtke
> On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 1:57 AM, Thomas Krichel <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> >   Wilhelmina Randtke writes
> >
> > > Pretty much the whole entire entry level programming class for the
> > average
> > > class covers using code to do things that you can do much more easily
> > > without code.
> >
> >   Probably it was the wrong course. I think coding should start with
> >   building web pages. A calculator can't do that.
> >
> >   Cheers,
> >
> >   Thomas Krichel          
> >                             
> >                                                skype: thomaskrichel
> >

Cary Gordon
The Cherry Hill Company