Hi Chris, Well, BASIC style language is my "first" language. It is pretty easy for someone to start with. Kun -----Original Message----- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Chris Gray Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 9:17 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You *are* a coder. So what am I? I would suggest any attempt to teach people to code should begin with Software Carpentry <http://www.software-carpentry.org/about/90seconds.html>. An important point here is that there are many misconceptions about programing and teaching that won't stand up to empirical investigation. <http://software-carpentry.org/4_0/softeng/ebse.html> I'm afraid on that score, Perl is not a good choice for a first language (nor is VBScript or VBA). I know people won't like me for saying that but there is hope of getting past religious wars if we insist on evidence over opinion. Chris On 2/15/2013 8:59 AM, Joe Hourcle wrote: > On Feb 15, 2013, at 8:22 AM, Kyle Banerjee wrote: > >> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 7:40 AM, Jason Griffey <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >>> The vast, vast, vast, vast majority of people have absolutely no >>> clue how code translates into instructions for the magic glowing >>> screen they look at all day. Even a tiny bit of empowerment in that >>> arena can make huge differences in productivity and communication >>> abilities >>> >> This is what it boils down to. >> >> C4l is dominated by linux based web apps. For people in a typical >> office setting, the technologies these involve are a lousy place to >> start learning to program. What most of them need is very different >> than what is discussed here and it depends heavily on their use case and environment. >> >> A bit of VBA, vbs, or some proprietary scripting language that >> interfaces with an app they use all the time to help with a small >> problem is a more realistic entry point for most people. However, >> discussion of such things is practically nonexistent here. > Well, as you mention that ... I'm one of the organizers of the > DC-Baltimore Perl Workshop : > > http://dcbpw.org/dcbpw2013/ > > Last year, we targeted the beginner's track as a sort of 'Perl as a > second language', assuming that you already knew the basic concepts of > programming (what's a variable, an array, a function, > etc.) > > Would it be worth us aiming for an even lower level of expertise? > > -Joe > > ps. Students & the unemployed are free ... $25 before March 1st, > $50 after; will be April 20th at U. Baltimore. We're also > in talks with a training company to have either another track > of paid training or a separate day (likely Sunday); they > wouldn't necessarily be Perl-specific.