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I'm currently experimenting with and developing a new SubjectsPlus installation. I'm the only full-time librarian at my institution and it has been mostly a breeze to install, alter, and find help from other users through its Google Group. www.ctslibrary.org/subsplus/ Now if only I could devote the time to actually completing the subject guides, that would be great! Evan Evan Boyd | Assistant Librarian Chicago Theological Seminary | 1407 E. 60th St., Chicago, IL 60637 773-896-2452 | [log in to unmask] | commons.ctschicago.edu -----Original Message----- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Julia Bauder Sent: Monday, August 12, 2013 9:10 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] LibGuides: I don't get it Hi Dave, There's a list of libraries using SubjectsPlus here: http://subjectsplus.com/wiki/index.php?title=Sites_using_SubjectsPlus Julia ********************************************* Julia Bauder Social Studies and Data Services Librarian Grinnell College Libraries 1111 Sixth Ave. Grinnell, IA 50112 641-269-4431 On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 9:07 AM, davesgonechina <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > You guys are awesome, this is great stuff, really helpful. My > impression of libguides has been fairly negative for many of the > reasons mentioned, but Sean has a good point about content strategy > and training, and Wilhemina has a good point about the costs of open > source not always being appreciated. > > Has anyone tried the two platforms Andrew Darby mentioned, > SubjectsPlus and Library a la Carte? That's the sort of thing I've > been looking for but never found until now. > > Dave > > > On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 9:57 PM, Sean Hannan <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > Again, this not a technical issue. It's a content strategy issue. > > > > Believe me, I was where you were. I was using all kinds of > > javascript and CSS hacks to try to prevent people from getting > > creative with color. I > was > > getting to the point of setting up Capybara tests to run against the > guides > > to alert me to abusive uses of bold and italics. > > > > The folks creating guides are content people, not web people. Take > > the > web > > out of it. Focus on the content. Pick a couple heuristics to educate > > them on (we picked 7 +/- 2, above the fold/below the fold, and > > F-shaped reading patterns). Above all, show them statistics. And not > > the built-in > LibGuides > > stats, either. > > > > New vs. returning. Average time on page. Pageviews over the course > > of a year. Very, very, very quickly our librarians realized what > > content is important, what content is superfluous, and that the time > > the spend carefully manicuring and maintaining their guides would > > (and could) be better spent elsewhere. > > > > -Sean > > > > On 8/12/13 9:35 AM, "Joshua Welker" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > > > I just have to say I have been thinking the exact same thing about > > LibGuides > > > for the two years I've been using it. I feel vindicated knowing > > > others > > feel > > > the same way. > > > > > > At UCMO, we will be migrating to Drupal in the next several > > > months, and > > I am > > > hoping very much that I can convince people to use less LibGuides. > > > > > > LibGuides is great in its ease of use, but fails on just about > > > every > > design > > > principle I can think of. There have been several studies on "tab > > blindness" > > > in LibGuides, and don't get me started on the sub-tab links that > > > are > > hiding > > > and require the user to mouse over a tab to even see what is there. > I've > > > tried telling people so many times to have just a few tabs and > > > always > to > > use > > > a table of contents for the main page, but they rarely do. And it > becomes > > > just about impossible to have a consistent look and feel across > > > your > > website > > > when LibGuides allows guide creators to modify every element on > > > the > page > > as > > > they see fit. People will do crazy things like putting page > > > content in > a > > > sidebar element, something you'd never ever ever see on any > > > website on > > the > > > Internet. I tried to enforce uniform colors and column sizes > > > across all > > the > > > guides, but I was told to let it go because my coworkers wanted to > > > be > > able > > > to decide those things on a guide-by-guide basis. > > > > > > I've worked at two institutions that use LibGuides, and what > > > inevitably happens is that librarians create one Uber Guide for > > > entire subject > areas > > > (biology, religion, etc) and then create sub-pages for all the > > > dozens > of > > > specific disciplines within those subject areas. And then, > > > assuming the > > user > > > somehow manages to find these pages, they are typically not much > > > more > > than a > > > list of links that could have easily been included on the main > > > library website. > > > > > > Okay, sorry for the rant. It has been building up for several > > > years and never had a chance to voice out. > > > > > > Josh Welker > > > Information Technology Librarian > > > James C. Kirkpatrick Library > > > University of Central Missouri > > > Warrensburg, MO 64093 > > > JCKL 2260 > > > 660.543.8022 > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Code for Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On > > > Behalf > Of > > > Robert Sebek > > > Sent: Sunday, August 11, 2013 11:21 AM > > > To: [log in to unmask] > > > Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] LibGuides: I don't get it > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Heather Rayl <[log in to unmask]> > wrote: > > > > > >> I have to say that I loathe LibGuides. My library makes extensive > > >> use of them, too. Need a web solution? The first thing out of > > >> someone's mouth is "Let's put it in a LibGuide!" > > >> > > >> Shudder > > >> > > >> This fall, I'll be moving our main site over to Drupal, and I'm > > >> hoping that eventually I can convince people to re-invent their > > >> LibGuides there. I can use the "saving money" card, and the > > >> "content silos are bad" card and > > >> *maybe* I will be successful. > > >> > > >> Anyone fought this particular battle before? > > >> > > >> ~heather > > >> > > >> I'm fighting that battle right now. We have an excellent CMS into > > >> which I > > > have set up all our database URLs, descriptions, etc.Anytime we > > > need to refer to a database on a page, we use one of those > > > entries. That > database > > > just changed platforms? No problem. I change the URL in one place > > > and everything automatically updates (hooray CMSs!). > > > > > > All of our subject guides (http://www.lib.vt.edu/subject-guides/) > > > are > > in the > > > CMS using the exact same database entries. I converted from our > failing, > > > home-grown system into the CMS and then gave training on how to > maintain > > > from there (remove an entry, add an entry, create a parallel > > > course guide)--using the same skills as maintaining any other web > > > page that librarian is responsible for. But apparently that's too hard. > > > > > > So we have a trial of LibGuides. NO ONE here has created a guide > > > from scratch yet, but they all say this is going to be easy. No > > > one will > > admit > > > that someone will have to recreate all those database entries > (literally > > > hundreds) and then maintain those entries. When presented with > > > this, > > several > > > librarians said--oh that won't be necessary, we'll just create > individual > > > entries as needed on individual guides. WHAT?! > > > > > > If implemented, we'll have hundreds and hundreds of entries, any > > > of > which > > > could be out of date and nonfunctional, with no easy way to find > > > and > fix, > > > other than waiting for patrons to complain that the link doesn't work. > > Ugh. > > > All for several thousand dollar a year (as opposed for free in the > CMS). > > > > > > And yes, those librarians' favorite example libguides have a dozen > > > tabs > > with > > > hundreds of links on each tab. Overwhelm the patron with > > > links--who > > cares! > > > Just let me recreate the Yahoo Directory I so miss with every > > > possible resource I can find online. Half those links don't work next semester? > > > Doesn't matter, as no one will ever maintain that page again (and > > > no > > patron > > > will use it, since they will just Google these resources anyway). > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Robert Sebek > > > Webmaster, Virginia Tech Libraries > > > (http://www.lib.vt.edu/) > > >