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Some notes on participation/inclusion: 1) It can be difficult integrating yourself into a group where you may feel like more or less of an outsider. An on-boarding experience of some sort - even so simple as a web page for new users might help. The code4lib website has little pieces of advice sprinkled around, two separate articles on the wiki and then there is a pretty good document on how to make code4lib inclusive. I would be happy to contribute to this effort, by the way. 2) The listserv front-end isn't new user friendly. It isn't overly complex in order to get subscribed/started, but it definitely isn't intuitive either. You're also always going to have trouble with getting people to ask questions, unless the concept of asking for help/guidance has been drilled into them as not stupid, but constructive, for a very long time. I'm talking life span. On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 6:42 AM, Julie Swierczek < [log in to unmask]> wrote: > I just want to respond to let people know that Kyle and I have been > discussing this further through private channels, and we agree on many > points. My earlier response was not meant to be a criticism of what Kyle > said specifically; rather, I was responding to what I see are the larger > challenges to the idea that codes of conduct should still be a main focus > (as evidenced by Sue’s contribution about the backlash against diversity in > the Naval War College). We also talked about how people want to talk about > things on-list and off-list, privately or anonymously. Kyle’s main issue > was really a question about what to do with private and anonymous feedback > – not that we should avoid it, but rather we should discuss how that should > be handled. For example, could someone summarize it, remove identifying > details, and report back to the group? Not about the Duty Officer > candidacy, since those are personnel issues, but rather about other > feedback about harassment, etc. If we ! > have those channels, what do we do with the information that is received > through them? > > We also agreed that listservs – both here and elsewhere – seem to have > shrinking participation over time, and there does seem to be a drive to > pull more conversations out of the public eye. There is no question that > some matters are best discussed in private channels, such as feedback about > individual candidates for duty officers, or matters pertaining to physical > and mental well-being. But when it comes to discussing technology or other > professional matters, there seems to be a larger trend of more responses > going off listservs. (I, for one, generally do not reply to questions on > listservs and instead reply to the OP privately because I’ve been burned to > many times publicly. The main listserv for archivists in the US has such a > bad reputation for flaming that it has its own hashtag: #thatdarnlist.) > > Maybe we can brainstorm about common reasons for people not using the > list: impostor syndrome (I don’t belong here and/or I certainly don’t have > the right ‘authority’ to respond to this); fear of being judged - we see > others being judged on a list (about the technological finesse of their > response, for instance) so we don’t want to put ourselves in a position > where we will be judged; fear of talking in general because we have seen > other people harmed for bringing their ideas to public forums (cf. doxing > and swatting); fear of looking stupid in general. > > That last one has me really puzzled because it seems to be a growing > problem. Whenever I teach basic tech stuff to people, I spend a lot of > time telling them that they are not stupid and I will never judge them if > they ask me questions. I give them lots of excuses so they can ask for my > help and not feel stupid. I tell them that they should ask me questions > because I'm easier to access than the product help manual. I tell them to > ask me because sometimes software does, in fact, have bugs in it, and the > problem is not the user, it's the software. I tell them that if they are > 'too busy' to do something themselves, they should just ask for my help. I > tell them to ask me because it is *my job* to answer their questions and > make this thing easier for them to use. I give them so many ways that they > can think of themselves as 'not stupid' for asking a question, and they > *still* contact me and say, "This is a stupid question, but..." I feel > like I need to start going to trainin! > g sessions and tell people that I have a 'tip jar' online, and every time > someone says "This is a stupid question", they have to put 0.05 bitcoin in > the tip jar. I could retire. > > I think this is something we need to talk about, and I’d be happy to talk > about it at the conference with anyone who is interested. (Kyle > unfortunately will not be in attendance this year.) I’d also be interested > to know if anyone has any info about psycho-social studies, reports, > whatever, on whether there really is a growing problem with avoiding > participation or asking questions for fear of feeling stupid and, more > importantly, if there are recommendations for overcoming that tendency. I > suspect people involved with adult education might have some ideas, for > example. I once attended a session for math tutors where the instructor > said, “Never tell the student “This is easy!” If the student still can’t > do it, they’ll feel even worse because they don’t get it AND it’s supposed > to be easy.” What other ways do we say things that are meant to be > positive and helpful but actually end up making things worse? > > I have only been participating in code4lib for a year, and it definitely > jumps up and down and shouts, “We’re inclusive! If you are interested at > all in tech, you belong here!” Can we encourage more participation on > this listserv (and others)? >