Sorry all. The original question posed by Chad was whether or not we should
be concerned about the number of women presenters at Code4Lib.  I countered
with a "Dunno?  How many women are in the community?"

If the survey finds that the "number of women that proposed a talk" =
"number of women in the community" then we might want another survey to
focus on why women aren't in this community -- at which point we would be
aiming the survey at a different group of people.

If the survey finds that the "number of women that proposed a talk" <
"number of women in the community" then we might want another survey to
focus on why women aren't getting involved in this community -- at which
point we would be aiming the survey just at this list.

So the survey I propose first seeks to take a look at gender demographics.
 Once we know that, then we can do more.  Make sense?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNlSv4SUYWo


On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 12:03 PM, Karen Coyle <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Rosalyn,
>
> That could be interesting, but the real issue would be to compare those
> results with actual employment results. The members of c4l are
> self-selected and won't be representative of the actual worker-bee
> situation. (e.g. it will be heavily weighted for academic libraries, I bet).
>
> kc
>
>
> On 11/27/12 8:46 AM, Rosalyn Metz wrote:
>
>> Ok since I brought up our demographics I'll run the survey (I like
>> surveys).  Simple survey with two questions:
>>
>> 1) Do you consider yourself part of the Code4Lib Community
>> 2) What is your self-identified gender
>>
>> I'll send it out at the end of today if there are no objections to the
>> questions and then share findings next week.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>> Rosalyn
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 11:23 AM, Karen Coyle <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>>  I would really like to see such a survey. I did one at my previous place
>>> of work, the California Digital Library (nee Division of Library
>>> Automation) where I worked for over 20 years. I had kept org charts and
>>> phone lists, and was able to see that over that span of two decades the
>>> tech staff (which was most everyone there since all we did was tech
>>> development) was from 2/3 to 3/4 female. But when I said this in front
>>> of a
>>> group of employees the men were startled. I'm guessing that they saw
>>> themselves as techies, and the women as "helpers" -- even though the DBA,
>>> the data designers, and many of the programmers were women. So it's not
>>> that there aren't women in technology, it's that the women in technology
>>> are often considered to be "not doing technology" because they are women.
>>> [1]
>>>
>>> So we should survey. I believe that we will find that in library
>>> technology departments there are many "invisible" women. Sadly, women
>>> will
>>> be more present in that environment for the wrong reasons -- mainly that
>>> it's lower paying and that men are more likely to get the higher paying
>>> industry jobs. (The University of California overall staff ratio is 65%
>>> female -- as perhaps many government agencies are.)
>>>
>>> kc
>>> [1] Must read: Joanna Russ. How to suppress women's writing.
>>> http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/****9392874<http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/**9392874>
>>> <http://www.worldcat.**org/oclc/9392874<http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/9392874>>It's
>>> about writing but actually pertains to all activities.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/27/12 6:57 AM, Rosalyn Metz wrote:
>>>
>>>  I think first we would need to do a survey of how many women are in the
>>>> community.  if it turns out that this community is only 17% women then
>>>> we're on target.  who knows, maybe we're actually 10% women and we're
>>>> way
>>>> above target.  in which case the real question might be "how do we get
>>>> more
>>>> women in tech."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Chad Nelson <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>   Ooops. Hit the wrong key.
>>>>
>>>>> So, about our presenters...
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it a problem that only 4 of our 33 presenters are women? Or that
>>>>> only
>>>>> 16
>>>>> of 95 proposers were women?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there something this community needs to do to encourage more women
>>>>> to
>>>>> feel like they can and should speak / propose sessions?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  --
>>> Karen Coyle
>>> [log in to unmask] http://kcoyle.net
>>> ph: 1-510-540-7596
>>> m: 1-510-435-8234
>>> skype: kcoylenet
>>>
>>>
> --
> Karen Coyle
> [log in to unmask] http://kcoyle.net
> ph: 1-510-540-7596
> m: 1-510-435-8234
> skype: kcoylenet
>